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	<title>Comments on: Once again riding the wave&#8230;</title>
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	<link>http://www.varnernet.com/~bryan/2005/08/21/once-again-riding-the-wave/</link>
	<description>The Runnoff of my brain, in Digital Form</description>
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		<title>By: JonathanThompson</title>
		<link>http://www.varnernet.com/~bryan/2005/08/21/once-again-riding-the-wave/comment-page-1/#comment-1091</link>
		<dc:creator>JonathanThompson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Aug 2005 00:11:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bryan.varnernet.com/archives/2005/08/21/once-again-riding-the-wave/#comment-1091</guid>
		<description>Marcus is living in a dangerous situation, in that regardless of the legality of what he&#039;s doing or not doing, he could still get smeared in the court of law, if only by being dragged into court and having to fight for his right to continue to do as he has in the past: work on things beyond what some particular party had assigned to him, and talk about things that some particular party has no right to interfere with.  If, indeed, Marcus were actually disclosing things that were rightfully covered under NDA, then he is acting foolishly, indeed.  However, I don&#039;t see what the logic of that would be, and publishing it for all the world to see.  It would be a weird situation at best for someone to have created all that Marcus has created and not understand what he&#039;s been dealing with in terms of what is allowable and what is not allowable to reveal, as it seems to me the understanding of what&#039;s right/wrong to reveal is rather simple compared to implementation of what should/shouldn&#039;t be revealed.

As far as Bernd trying to throw a blanket of NDA over a specific email that includes things that aren&#039;t valid for him to claim NDA coverage of and possibly throwing some small mention of something that is, well, at best, that&#039;s playing dirty pool, and at worst, it would seem to me that would be illegal, as I can see that as a form of blackmail: saying &quot;This is all under terms of NDA&quot; and then throwing something dirty at the person in the email.

Well, if there&#039;s one thing that the big boys have learned, if you have anything you don&#039;t feel comfortable announcing via a TV report in front of a TV audience live, you should NEVER put it in email, because it gives too much proof of what was said, when, how, etc. and is very traceable, as it leaves a path behind.  If Microsoft and Sun aren&#039;t immune to this, Bernd thinking he&#039;d be immune to this is even crazier!

Which points out one more thing that all developers should do, filed under the category of &quot;CYA&quot; and that&#039;s keep logs/copies of all communication for reference in the future.  These days, storage space is incredibly cheap when done electronically.  I expect it&#039;d be rare for correspondence that&#039;s development-related to things you have under NDA or some other thing would fill a CD.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Marcus is living in a dangerous situation, in that regardless of the legality of what he&#8217;s doing or not doing, he could still get smeared in the court of law, if only by being dragged into court and having to fight for his right to continue to do as he has in the past: work on things beyond what some particular party had assigned to him, and talk about things that some particular party has no right to interfere with.  If, indeed, Marcus were actually disclosing things that were rightfully covered under NDA, then he is acting foolishly, indeed.  However, I don&#8217;t see what the logic of that would be, and publishing it for all the world to see.  It would be a weird situation at best for someone to have created all that Marcus has created and not understand what he&#8217;s been dealing with in terms of what is allowable and what is not allowable to reveal, as it seems to me the understanding of what&#8217;s right/wrong to reveal is rather simple compared to implementation of what should/shouldn&#8217;t be revealed.</p>
<p>As far as Bernd trying to throw a blanket of NDA over a specific email that includes things that aren&#8217;t valid for him to claim NDA coverage of and possibly throwing some small mention of something that is, well, at best, that&#8217;s playing dirty pool, and at worst, it would seem to me that would be illegal, as I can see that as a form of blackmail: saying &#8220;This is all under terms of NDA&#8221; and then throwing something dirty at the person in the email.</p>
<p>Well, if there&#8217;s one thing that the big boys have learned, if you have anything you don&#8217;t feel comfortable announcing via a TV report in front of a TV audience live, you should NEVER put it in email, because it gives too much proof of what was said, when, how, etc. and is very traceable, as it leaves a path behind.  If Microsoft and Sun aren&#8217;t immune to this, Bernd thinking he&#8217;d be immune to this is even crazier!</p>
<p>Which points out one more thing that all developers should do, filed under the category of &#8220;CYA&#8221; and that&#8217;s keep logs/copies of all communication for reference in the future.  These days, storage space is incredibly cheap when done electronically.  I expect it&#8217;d be rare for correspondence that&#8217;s development-related to things you have under NDA or some other thing would fill a CD.</p>
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		<title>By: Bryan</title>
		<link>http://www.varnernet.com/~bryan/2005/08/21/once-again-riding-the-wave/comment-page-1/#comment-1090</link>
		<dc:creator>Bryan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Aug 2005 18:41:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bryan.varnernet.com/archives/2005/08/21/once-again-riding-the-wave/#comment-1090</guid>
		<description>I didn&#039;t remove it. Google places the ads automatically, based on the content of the page. If the page&#039;s content changes, Google will change the ads.

I have not blacklisted or removed any advertisements. Likewise, I have never edited any comments posted by others.

But yeah, I&#039;ll try to keep up the good fight.

I&#039;m not saying don&#039;t buy from YellowTab, I just think everyone should be aware of what kind of company they do business with. If YT wants to kick developers in the sack, that&#039;s their decision. The thing I don&#039;t agree with is all these people saying that squabbles like this should be kept hush-hush and that these kinds of tiffs being brought into the public is unprofessional. On the contrary, I think it takes a lot of balls to do what Marcus has done, and I think it&#039;s far more professional than hushing it all up and pretending it didn&#039;t happen.


HYPOTHETICALLY:
Let&#039;s say I&#039;m a developer who&#039;s never heard of BeOS or Zeta before. I strike some form of agreement with YellowTab, and then they kick me in the balls, make me pick up their soap in the showerhouse, or otherwise screw me over. I&#039;m mad, I&#039;m pissed, and I&#039;m wondering if this isn&#039;t their standard operating procedure. Then I find out from several other developers sending me private messages that I&#039;m only one in a long line of people who&#039;ve been ripped off, screwed, and had their hard work obscounded with. Gee, if I&#039;d known this from the beginning, I wouldn&#039;t have worked with YT.

It&#039;s like working for a mobbed up company without knowing it, and then one day they want you to drop a heavy plastic bag tied to cinder blocks in the river. It was expected of you all along, but you just didn&#039;t know the full terms. Now you&#039;re either going to blow the whistle and get smeared (or shot in the head) around town or you&#039;re going to be complacent and allow the bad behavior to continue.

I&#039;m saying that people like Marcus being able to speak out HELPS the community by keeping us honest. You can&#039;t build a platform on deciet. M$ dosen&#039;t lie about windows shortcomings, they will sling mud at their competitors and pay billions to get people to think they have an outstanding product. Ask them if NTFS is suitable for the next ten years and they&#039;ll say no. Ask them if XP is secure enough and they&#039;ll say no. But do they make it a habit to rape, pillage, and steal from their 3rd party developers? No. They buy them out the good ole&#039; fashioned, and honest way.

Does apple steal ideas from 3rd parties? Yes. Are they big enough to do it? yes. Do they get away with it? Yes. Do they do it illegally? No. Does YellowTab? I&#039;d hope not. But what you&#039;ll never see is Steve Jobs or Bill Gates cutting down a developer, no matter what they may have done.

So my question is: How is Marcus exposing (what may be) harsh treatment, unprofessional behavior, and a total lack of regard for the hand that feeds them (developers are essential to yellow tabs future) unprofessional? As a professional that may someday want to make some form of investment in YT (be it time, development, or purchasing a copy of Zeta) I find his behavior of being honest, forthcoming, and sincere far more professional than anything I&#039;ve seen from YT.

Call me crazy, but I still believe in a thing called ethics.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I didn&#8217;t remove it. Google places the ads automatically, based on the content of the page. If the page&#8217;s content changes, Google will change the ads.</p>
<p>I have not blacklisted or removed any advertisements. Likewise, I have never edited any comments posted by others.</p>
<p>But yeah, I&#8217;ll try to keep up the good fight.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m not saying don&#8217;t buy from YellowTab, I just think everyone should be aware of what kind of company they do business with. If YT wants to kick developers in the sack, that&#8217;s their decision. The thing I don&#8217;t agree with is all these people saying that squabbles like this should be kept hush-hush and that these kinds of tiffs being brought into the public is unprofessional. On the contrary, I think it takes a lot of balls to do what Marcus has done, and I think it&#8217;s far more professional than hushing it all up and pretending it didn&#8217;t happen.</p>
<p>HYPOTHETICALLY:<br />
Let&#8217;s say I&#8217;m a developer who&#8217;s never heard of BeOS or Zeta before. I strike some form of agreement with YellowTab, and then they kick me in the balls, make me pick up their soap in the showerhouse, or otherwise screw me over. I&#8217;m mad, I&#8217;m pissed, and I&#8217;m wondering if this isn&#8217;t their standard operating procedure. Then I find out from several other developers sending me private messages that I&#8217;m only one in a long line of people who&#8217;ve been ripped off, screwed, and had their hard work obscounded with. Gee, if I&#8217;d known this from the beginning, I wouldn&#8217;t have worked with YT.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s like working for a mobbed up company without knowing it, and then one day they want you to drop a heavy plastic bag tied to cinder blocks in the river. It was expected of you all along, but you just didn&#8217;t know the full terms. Now you&#8217;re either going to blow the whistle and get smeared (or shot in the head) around town or you&#8217;re going to be complacent and allow the bad behavior to continue.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m saying that people like Marcus being able to speak out HELPS the community by keeping us honest. You can&#8217;t build a platform on deciet. M$ dosen&#8217;t lie about windows shortcomings, they will sling mud at their competitors and pay billions to get people to think they have an outstanding product. Ask them if NTFS is suitable for the next ten years and they&#8217;ll say no. Ask them if XP is secure enough and they&#8217;ll say no. But do they make it a habit to rape, pillage, and steal from their 3rd party developers? No. They buy them out the good ole&#8217; fashioned, and honest way.</p>
<p>Does apple steal ideas from 3rd parties? Yes. Are they big enough to do it? yes. Do they get away with it? Yes. Do they do it illegally? No. Does YellowTab? I&#8217;d hope not. But what you&#8217;ll never see is Steve Jobs or Bill Gates cutting down a developer, no matter what they may have done.</p>
<p>So my question is: How is Marcus exposing (what may be) harsh treatment, unprofessional behavior, and a total lack of regard for the hand that feeds them (developers are essential to yellow tabs future) unprofessional? As a professional that may someday want to make some form of investment in YT (be it time, development, or purchasing a copy of Zeta) I find his behavior of being honest, forthcoming, and sincere far more professional than anything I&#8217;ve seen from YT.</p>
<p>Call me crazy, but I still believe in a thing called ethics.</p>
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		<title>By: mikesum32</title>
		<link>http://www.varnernet.com/~bryan/2005/08/21/once-again-riding-the-wave/comment-page-1/#comment-1089</link>
		<dc:creator>mikesum32</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Aug 2005 05:49:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://bryan.varnernet.com/archives/2005/08/21/once-again-riding-the-wave/#comment-1089</guid>
		<description>I think we should have some sort of download kit.

I thought it was in the works.

Oh, I see you removed the Zeta goooogle ad that keyed in on your yellowtab is evil post.

Keep up the good fight.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think we should have some sort of download kit.</p>
<p>I thought it was in the works.</p>
<p>Oh, I see you removed the Zeta goooogle ad that keyed in on your yellowtab is evil post.</p>
<p>Keep up the good fight.</p>
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